Anne Will on the energy import ban: “Turn off the gas tap a little more every day”

Russia is continuing its war of aggression in Ukraine with all its might. Before the impression of the terrible pictures from Butscha, Anne Will’s talk is about an end to Russian energy supplies. When asked about the timing, the opinions of the guests are divided.

What is currently happening in the Ukraine is difficult to imagine in the heated living rooms of the Federal Republic. People stay in their cellars for weeks and live on the last canned food they have. In the besieged areas, they must always expect to be subjected to violence by Russian soldiers – in the worst case resulting in death. Images of war crimes in Bucha, among other places, are causing shock in this country and once again raising the question of what price Germany can and should pay in order to show Russia and its President Vladimir Putin the limits.

Marieluise Beck has seen the destruction and war in Ukraine for herself over the past few days. The Green politician traveled to Kyiv, spoke to the local people and said on Sunday evening on “Anne Will”: “What is happening there in Ukraine is so unimaginable.” The suffering of the people must give reason to “perhaps we have to rethink what we can endure”.

The Eastern Europe expert at the think tank Zentrum Liberale Moderne addresses the core problem of the German debate. Voices are increasing calling for a freeze on energy supplies from Russia in order to inflict severe economic damage on the Russian regime. But Germany would face a huge challenge given the scarcity and few alternatives to Russian gas and – to a lesser extent – oil and coal. Can the economy and society support this?

Veronika Grimm assumes that this should be possible. The economist is a member of the Advisory Council for the assessment of overall economic development, i.e. one of five so-called economic experts. She cites analyzes according to which Germany would have to reckon with a 2.5 to 6 percent discount on economic development if imports were to be stopped. No more and no less. But she also makes it clear: “Nobody said that it would be easy to cope with.” In the event of an immediate renunciation of oil and gas from Russia, the German state would have to provide the companies with help.

Import stop yes, but please not immediately

“When you see these pictures, everyone immediately has the emotion to say that we must now do everything that is right to end this war,” says SPD leader Lars Klingbeil about the harrowing footage from Butscha. According to the Ukrainian army, a number of civilian bodies were found in the Kyiv suburb. They were allegedly murdered by Russian forces and left lying on the street.

Klingbeil thinks an immediate energy embargo is wrong. It will not stop the “brutal killings” by Putin’s troops. “We’re turning off the gas tap a little more every day,” he says, referring to the traffic light government, which is currently looking for alternative providers on the world market for gas, oil and coal under Economics Minister Robert Habeck.

Klingbeil has a supporter – at least on this issue – in CSU boss Markus Söder. An immediate energy import ban would cause serious skid marks in Germany, says the Bavarian Prime Minister. Large parts of the economy would be thrown off track as a result. Energy-intensive companies would have to accept enormous damage. An import stop is needed “as soon as possible, I’m there, but not overnight”.

According to Söder, he also has an eye on ordinary citizens who are already suffering from high inflation. His credo: Ukraine must be helped, but the government is also committed to the people in Germany. It’s about millions of jobs.

Emotion versus political reason?

In this context, Söder repeats his call for nuclear energy to continue in the years to come. He is not a “fetishist”, but millions of households are supplied with electricity through nuclear power plants. Economist Grimm also sees it that way, who states that she has now changed her mind on the subject and is now also in favor of an extension.

SPD boss Klingbeil should think little of such mind games. Instead, he emphasizes that Germany must avoid endangering the competitiveness of its companies and ultimately strengthening authoritarian regimes such as China as a result of a migrating industry. Beijing remains loyal to Moscow and is slowly but surely emerging as one of Russia’s most important political and economic allies. To the vehemently raised objections of the Green Party politician Beck, who emphasized the suffering of the Ukrainians in the discussion, Klingbeil replies that he cannot allow himself to be emotionally driven when making political decisions.

The deputy editor-in-chief of “Welt”, Robin Alexander, then reproaches him and also the connected Söder that the government in 2014/15 with political mistakes drove Germany into the current misery. At that time, refineries and storage capacities were sold to Russian companies. At a time “when the first wave of this war was already underway,” says the journalist, referring to the illegal annexation of Crimea and eastern Ukraine. Germany became more dependent on Russia for energy in the years that Putin was arming himself.

“We’re talking about old stuff from the NVA”

Anne Will is not only about energy, but also about weapons. Again and again, representatives of Ukraine complain that the Federal Republic is delivering too few. Government member Klingbeil does not want to look too deeply into the matter. He assures that Germany is delivering more than is publicly known. This finds little resonance in the talk show.

According to Marieluise Beck, Germany isn’t delivering what Ukraine is asking for in terms of weapons – “and it’s too late and not enough.” Journalist Alexander pointed out: “If only Ukraine had the weapons that Germany had supplied, then Putin would have won.” With a view to the armored personnel carriers that have recently become public, he also points out: “We’re talking about old stuff from the NVA.”

For Beck, who argues with commitment, it is clear that the federal government must take decisive steps in the coming days, both in terms of weapons equipment and the embargo question. She says of Berlin’s current politics: “The bitterness in Ukraine and the disappointment with the Germans is hard to believe.”

The pressure to act is great. There is already massive destruction in Ukraine. Beck says there will be nothing left of the country in the next two to three years. Putin is capable of destroying entire regions and is ready for anything “if we don’t oppose it”. The former member of the Bundestag warns: “We should start taking what Putin says seriously.”

source site-34