How well our defenses work also depends on what ends up on our plate – and what doesn’t. Nutritionist Professor Andreas Michalsen on the healing power of fiber, fasting and spices.
Have you already done something for the immune system today, for example at breakfast?
Professor Dr. Andreas Michalsen: I ate oatmeal with flax seeds, walnuts and almond milk and a slice of sourdough bread with almond butter. And of course drank two good espressos (laughs).
Don’t you swear by intermittent fasting, take a 16-hour meal break from the evening and don’t eat breakfast at all?
I’m adjusting a little while doing intermittent fasting. The scientific data still shows that fasting is good for our body and our immune system. But the latest research tends to suggest that it is better to skip dinner.
Did your first meal today still help your body catch possible pathogens?
Yes, because what I have eaten is good for my intestines – and it is very important for my immune system. Oats, for example, contain beta-glucans, i.e. multiple sugars, which the good intestinal bacteria feed on. And they in turn have an impact on my immune system. And the whole grain in oats and bread is also great for my intestinal flora.
Do we now know more about the role that the various bacteria that settle in the digestive tract play in our health?
Unfortunately, we are only just beginning to understand the intestine and its part in the immune system. Everything that we as nutritionists say about it can therefore only be approximate. Basically, research learns about 100 new bacteria every week; then there are also fungi and microbes, all of which is extremely complex and complicated. That’s why I always have to grin when I stand in the pharmacy and see probiotics that are supposed to work specifically against migraines. Right now we are like auto mechanics, knowing that the engine powers the vehicle and that it needs gasoline.
But you still made a recommendation for breakfast.
Yes, because I am convinced that many studies simply suggest: Eat a lot of fiber, which is what feeds the beneficial intestinal bacteria. We have had a useful community of convenience with these tiny creatures for a very long time: They help us to digest what is actually indigestible, and at the same time produce healthy substances for our body. So we should treat them nicely and feed them whole grains, nuts and vegetables.
Prof. Dr. Andreas Michalsen is a professor of naturopathy, chief physician at the Immanuel Hospital in Berlin and author of the bestsellers “Heal with nutrition” and “Healing with the power of nature“, which has been published in an expanded new edition (Insel-Verlag).
© Tagesspiegel / imago images
However, you are mainly known for what you do not eat …
You are referring to my first book and intermittent fasting. I still advise everyone to do that. To be fair, I have to say that we are talking about animal studies and laboratory experiments for many of the findings. But they show amazing effects that fasting has on our immune system. If we go without food for a while, the body switches into a kind of emergency mode. But that doesn’t weaken him, on the contrary. On the one hand, it clears away old, poorly functioning proteins and cell components; on the other hand, it increases the defense against germs. In the test tube one could observe that viruses are destroyed in this so-called autophagy, in some cases even the coronavirus SARS-CoV-2. But you have to be careful, as I said, it happened in the test tube. But my colleague Valter Longo found out a few years ago that fasting slows down the aging of the immune system.
I’m sending you to a lonely island where you can only eat one fruit and one vegetable that is good for your defense. Which would you choose?
As a nutritionist, I would answer you on the spur of the moment that too much of the same is not good for the body. But if I have to commit: red berries and broccoli. These are real champions for the immune system. Broccoli contains mustard oil, which helps fight bacteria, maybe even viruses. And the red berries boost the immune system with their phytochemicals. When I’m not on the lonely island, I mix as much as possible: apples, blueberries, a glass of pomegranate juice, broccoli. Not only vegetables are good, but also spices. Turmeric, ginger, garlic, red onions, thyme tea, sage tea, all of these have an antiviral effect. In garlic, for example, there are polyphenols that are deposited in the oral mucosa and protect us. Smells something, but helps.
And what can I do if I hate broccoli?
Then I would recommend that you eat some of it every now and then for four to eight weeks. Taste is a habit, it can be changed. But if after that, the moment you see broccoli still choke you, wonder what actually makes it so healthy. Mustard oil is also found in horseradish, rocket and of course mustard.
Now we’ve talked about how I can strengthen my defenses. With autoimmune diseases such as rheumatism or multiple sclerosis, the immune system is already overactive. Can nutrition help here too?
Indeed, for many inflammatory and autoimmune diseases, it has now been proven that the intestinal immune system and the bacteria in the intestine play a decisive role in the development and progression of the disease. This is the case with rheumatism, multiple sclerosis, inflammatory bowel disease or Parkinson’s. Unfortunately, it is not yet possible to deduce from this how an optimized diet can prevent or treat the disease. Once the process has started, it is difficult to influence it through diet. We and other universities are currently conducting studies on the therapeutic influence of therapeutic fasting, intermittent fasting, and plant-based or probiotic diets. We hope that we will soon better understand the complex processes and then be able to derive effective therapies from them.
You are also researching phytomedicine, i.e. herbal medicine. Which plants can support our defenses?
Some aromatic plants with high levels of antimicrobial substances are particularly recommended. These include sage, thyme, elderberry, licorice, ginger, garlic and onion. The sun hat has been used in general to prevent infections for many years. It can also support the immune system.
We have been talking all along now about the positive effects of diet. Conversely, what are real “immune killers” on our plate?
Overall, someone’s immune system works worse when he or she is overweight or obese. So if I eat too fatty and sugar-heavy food for a long time, I damage my body’s defenses. Specifically, this means: too much sugar and sweets, heavily processed foods such as frozen pizza and highly processed animal products such as sausage is unfavorable. There are also indications for salt that it weakens the immune system. But it is more about the long-term consequences. It’s not that we should be scared of doing great damage with a single meal.
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